Glories of Luna

Xerkics:

Thank you so much , the glories are lovely the only mild criticism i can think of is lack of new art and trees for the martial arts listed.

This is also a disappointment to me.

But the book is, on the whole, so very awesome. I actually started reading from the beginning and worked myself half-way through the fluff before jumping to the Charms. And then I returned and finished reading all of the fluff.

This may be the first Exalted book I have actually read every single word in.

Limited Reagent:

Aranni:

Especially loved the stories about getting to The Silver Chair.  Reminded me of the Discworld book, The Last Hero.

After my initial reading, I just want to say one thing:

I really, really want to go to the moon.

On a flying Whale Ship, constructed by the Lunarians! Er, I mean the Truculee!

Laleeho!

Here's a question: were they able to sneak in the "real" Lunars XP chart into this, like they did the Sidereals?

Am still reading through Luna (and have yet to even start on Maidens), but I have two things I wanna ask about.

1) This is actually about a pair of Solar charms, but it's more relevant to Lunar PCs, so yeah. I read the Solar Bond sidebar in MoEP:Lunars and came away from it with the impression that the bond usually was, but didn't necessarily have to be a positive one. And I loved that. I loved that my Mate could be my best friend, or my lover, or my friendly rival, or my most hated enemy. Certainly more interesting than "you can be their lover, or you can be their bestest best friend. No other options." Looking at it like this also made Solar Bond the background less of a huge drawback, since I could use it for things other than being an obedient little pet (in addition to using it for being an obedient little pet when it suited the character). And then the wording on Rose-Lipped Seduction Style rather firmly shot that idea down. Plus, Soul-Spanning Bridge Relay killed a charm idea I had for no apparent reason. Now, the closest I can get without actively defying canon to playing a Lunar who hates his/her Mate is a Lilith-esque creepy yandere - which has already been done in canon, with Lilith. Why did you write it like that? Is there a reason that I'm going to find satisfying, or is this yet another bit of canon that I'm going to have to flat-out ignore?

2) How exactly does breeding beastmen work? I'd like to be convinced that there's a reason that you apparently needed four Breeding charms when as far as I can tell A and D actually do something, B does the exact same thing as A, and C removes a drawback from B that doesn't make much sense being there in the first place.

EDIT SO I'M NOT JUST A COMPLAINING ASSHOLE: With the exception of these two complaints (and the Solar actionlong dodge being underwhelming - I prefered PoH's version more), I love Glories so far. The writeups of the Unconquered Sun and Luna made me go wow, and Final Ray of Light has replaced You Can Be More as my favorite Charm. It's mostly fantastic. I just... I wanna know about the bits that I don't think are fantastic.

EDIT TO COMPLAIN SOME MORE: I typed this up right after seeing the breeding charms. First thing I read upon going back to the PDF was the Bear Sleep improvement (cool!), followed by... the Charisma charms. Son of a bitch.

Lunar XP Chart wasn't broken, and I'd only give them their 1e chart back if I hated Lunars.

I think my favorite bit of celestial realm detailing is the bit where the argentim have to rely on truculee for gossip about Creation, and are thus constantly ill-informed because truculee are born liars.

Is it just me or is White Reaper style a little weak? I know it's great but it's instant charms burn all halos.

Inugami:

Narnia! The new Lunar Charms allow to play the part of Aslan and create your own fucking Narnia!

I'll elaborate.

The Charm called Limitless Argent Protectorate is identical to the Solar Charm, Wyld Shaping Technique. Except that it only works inside the Elsewhere pocket of Secure Den Prana, only creates land, wealth and people, and anything created within will vanish if it leaves the Den.

So, you can create Narnia, but it remains a fairytale kingdom in your personal closet. No real impact on the world outside. It makes a nice prison, day care, vacation spot, brothel, etc, etc. And when you die? Everyone inside probably dies or finds their world collapsing into Elsewhere. Glee!


And Frozen Ripple Lair annoys me. If it's really just Secure Den Prana with a time-warping effect, why is a separate Simple-type Charm instead of a permanent upgrade?


Implausible Lunar Panoply is awesome. "More than one Wyld Hunt has retreated in sudden disarray when an apparently unarmed Steward threw aside his cloak to reveal a light implosion bow." Hahaha!

Holden:

Lunar XP Chart wasn't broken, and I'd only give them their 1e chart back if I hated Lunars.

No, I was talking about these, as I've seen them bandied about as the "real" Lunar XP costs for quite some time now.

lumber_of_the_beast:

Am still reading through Luna (and have yet to even start on Maidens), but I have two things I wanna ask about.

1) This is actually about a pair of Solar charms, but it's more relevant to Lunar PCs, so yeah. I read the Solar Bond sidebar in MoEP:Lunars and came away from it with the impression that the bond usually was, but didn't necessarily have to be a positive one. And I loved that. I loved that my Mate could be my best friend, or my lover, or my friendly rival, or my most hated enemy. Certainly more interesting than "you can be their lover, or you can be their bestest best friend. No other options." Looking at it like this also made Solar Bond the background less of a huge drawback, since I could use it for things other than being an obedient little pet (in addition to using it for being an obedient little pet when it suited the character). And then the wording on Rose-Lipped Seduction Style rather firmly shot that idea down. Plus, Soul-Spanning Bridge Relay killed a charm idea I had for no apparent reason. Now, the closest I can get without actively defying canon to playing a Lunar who hates his/her Mate is a Lilith-esque creepy yandere - which has already been done in canon, with Lilith. Why did you write it like that? Is there a reason that I'm going to find satisfying, or is this yet another bit of canon that I'm going to have to flat-out ignore?

Solars don't have to take those Charms. I would expect that most Solars never would. But some of them did.

I wrote that Charm because for all that Last Ray of Hope shows Solars at their best, Glories also needed to show them at their worst. And their worst isn't Primordial Principle Emulation, or the Charm that lets them play with Abyssal Mirrors. Their worst is taking a metaphysical bond with those who trust them most, and viciously abusing it, because all the power in the bond runs one way. They didn't just engage in spousal abuse, they developed magic to let them get away with it.

It's awful, it's monstrous, and Rose-Lipped Seduction Style applied against your mate is a rape Charm by anyone's standards. It's there because Solars have the power to go there, and once they realized that, some of them did. The Lunars who stayed very far away from the Sun King Seneschals had some legitimate reasons for it.

This is the situation Lilith and others like her found themselves in, and it's a hideous situation, particularly in the First Age, when you could not get away with killing your mate for trying to pull something like that. If you find this horrifying, well, that was the intention.

2) How exactly does breeding beastmen work? I'd like to be convinced that there's a reason that you apparently needed four Breeding charms when as far as I can tell A and D actually do something, B does the exact same thing as A, and C removes a drawback from B that doesn't make much sense being there in the first place.

Breeding beastmen sans Charms requires that either A) you, in human form, fuck an animal while in the Wyld (and if female, this animal must be large enough to gestate a human-sized child, which generally means that at bare minimum you're working with something the size of a cow or horse), or B) you, in animal form, fuck a human while in the Wyld.

Inugami:

And Frozen Ripple Lair annoys me. If it's really just Secure Den Prana with a time-warping effect, why is a separate Simple-type Charm instead of a permanent upgrade?

Direct complaints about Frozen Ripple Lair to Peter Schaeffer. I didn't write it, I just wrote upgrades for it.

Implausible Lunar Panoply is awesome. "More than one Wyld Hunt has retreated in sudden disarray when an apparently unarmed Steward threw aside his cloak to reveal a light implosion bow." Hahaha!

:D

Argent Weaver Method is my favorite of the lot, I think.

Prompt reply is appreciated.

Holden:

Solars don't have to take those Charms. I would expect that most Solars never would. But some of them did.

I wrote that Charm because for all that Last Ray of Hope shows Solars at their best, Glories also needed to show them at their worst. And their worst isn't Primordial Principle Emulation, or the Charm that lets them play with Abyssal Mirrors. Their worst is taking a metaphysical bond with those who trust them most, and viciously abusing it, because all the power in the bond runs one way. They didn't just engage in spousal abuse, they developed magic to let them get away with it.

It's awful, it's monstrous, and Rose-Lipped Seduction Style applied against your mate is a rape Charm by anyone's standards. It's there because Solars have the power to go there, and once they realized that, some of them did. The Lunars who stayed very far away from the Sun King Seneschals had some legitimate reasons for it.

This is the situation Lilith and others like her found themselves in, and it's a hideous situation, particularly in the First Age, when you could not get away with killing your mate for trying to pull something like that. If you find this horrifying, well, that was the intention.

That actually misses my question. I'm fine with Solars being horrible dicks to their Lunar Mates. What I want to know is why it's so important that the nature of the bond (and, apparently, the Charms that play off it) make it so that Lunars can't be dicks right back.

Holden:

Breeding beastmen sans Charms requires that either A) you, in human form, fuck an animal while in the Wyld (and if female, this animal must be large enough to gestate a human-sized child, which generally means that at bare minimum you're working with something the size of a cow or horse), or B) you, in animal form, fuck a human while in the Wyld.

Huh... Think I'll still be cutting out Fish or Fowl Gestation from the tree, then. Thanks for the insight.

lumber_of_the_beast:

That actually misses my question. I'm fine with Solars being horrible dicks to their Lunar Mates. What I want to know is why it's so important that the nature of the bond (and, apparently, the Charms that play off it) make it so that Lunars can't be dicks right back.

1) Lunars are weaker. The Solar>Lunar relationship has never been presented otherwise.
2) Just because Lunars can't use the Solar Bond offensively doesn't mean they can't use it, say, to track down their mates with retribution in mind.

Which leads to...

3) Golden Widow Method.

Epimetheus:

Is it just me or is White Reaper style a little weak? I know it's great but it's instant charms burn all halos.

The question for me is, "If I have Bleeding Crescent Strike, Greatest Killer Attitude, and Enemies Like Grass all in the same Combo, does my current number of halos apply equally to all of them, and all attacks in the flurry?"

Or at least, "If I use Bleeding Crescent Strike and Greatest Killer Attitude for an action that includes only a single attack, do the halos count equally for both Charms, or would I have to divide them up?"

Nephilpal:

1) Lunars are weaker. The Solar>Lunar relationship has never been presented otherwise.

Not the point! Just because Al can kick Bob's ass doesn't mean that Bob can't be an asshole to Al.

Nephilpal:

2) Just because Lunars can't use the Solar Bond offensively doesn't mean they can't use it, say, to track down their mates with retribution in mind.

How would they use it? Apparently, it forces a positive bond; once you've gotten past that, you run into the snag where, with the exception of Golden Widow Method, every single power that Lunars have to draw on the Bond specifically requires them to be aiding the Solar. Good luck convincing an ST that eating said Solar counts as aid.

That said...

Nephilpal:

3) Golden Widow Method.

This looks like very much fun, and it certainly establishes a precedent that I like. The problem is that it conflicts with every single other bit of fluff and crunch about the Bond, except for the 2E Solar Bond sidebar, and even then only if read in a specific way.


EDIT: ...uh... should Laughing into the Teeth of Madness have the Obvious keyword?

Inugami:

Epimetheus:

Is it just me or is White Reaper style a little weak? I know it's great but it's instant charms burn all halos.

The question for me is, "If I have Bleeding Crescent Strike, Greatest Killer Attitude, and Enemies Like Grass all in the same Combo, does my current number of halos apply equally to all of them, and all attacks in the flurry?"

I think they would get blown on the first attack.

Or at least, "If I use Bleeding Crescent Strike and Greatest Killer Attitude for an action that includes only a single attack, do the halos count equally for both Charms, or would I have to divide them up?"

I think they should apply equally.