Resolving a Wound

Hi, everyone. 

I'm new to the forums, so please forgive my noobish posting style.  Anyhow, I've been running a game set in NYC for the last few months with some friends of mine.  I'm new to storytelling and am wondering what options to present to my players about a given situation.

The story is that a wound has arisen due to the actions of a den of savage vampires.  They took over an abandoned apartment building and used it as their personal feeding pit until the PC's pack came through and tore them all apart.  So now they have a wound in their territory.

I originally intended them to learn of the wound and then take some time to scout the place and figure out the best way to deal with it.  However, these guys are pretty gung-ho about wiping out any and all negative aspects of their land, so I need to come up with something quick. 

The pack learned that an elder Ithaeur (whom I said was off on a quest, deep in the spirit wilds, so as to buy me some time) may be able to perform a cleansing ritual at the heart of the place.  So the matter may come down to waiting for the elder to return/seeking him out, then imploring him to perform the rite (the pack is still young, so I don't feel any of them are capabale of performing the rite themselves) while they provide protection from whatever lies within the place.

Does that sound feasible to any of you more experienced players/ST's?  Any insight/information/advice you could share would be appreciated.  Thanks!

Oh wow, what a great setup you have going man, congrats! You may be new and feel akward with this whole ST thing, but it looks from here like your a natural pro. Great job so far, almost wish i had those kind of hooks in my game.
My story advise i would give to you would be to think on two fronts, the material and the spiritual. In the material you could have other associated vamps who were the sires\corterie members of the deceased vamps come around looking into what happened to their lost\dead childer\mates. You could tie this in with the spiritual by having the dark spirits there urge the vamps to hang around and pick up the same practices that were feeding them Essence before with the other group of vamps, but this time they're obviously more powerful\aware\organized this time around. Or perhaps your tastes lie more firmly in the spiritual, you could then have an entire spirit court in the Wound based around one of the Vices that was most prominent during the vamps stay, and now they are going to have none of this foolish interference by these halfbreeds! Anyone or anything stupid enough to enter the Wound in the Shadow now gets hurt bad due to the loss of their bread and butter diet of pain and suffering the vamps brought to them. ESPECIALLY those damned Uratha!
Hope that helps to some degree. Sorry i can't be more detailed, time is short at the moment. Good Luck! I know you'll be great!
Later.

ZombieKnowledge:

So the matter may come down to waiting for the elder to return/seeking him out, then imploring him to perform the rite (the pack is still young, so I don't feel any of them are capabale of performing the rite themselves) while they provide protection from whatever lies within the place.

If there is a ritualist in your players pack (i.e. a player who reaaaally enjoys the ritual side of the game)  you could have him assist with the ritual.  There are mechanics for group extended actions and its very in theme to have several shamans all chanting together to bring about the power of the spirits, so don't count them out of the rite itself offhand.  If they are more martially oriented yeah acting as defensive line would definately be good, give them time to try and set up defenses at the site if possible, maybe construct some fetishes or talens, or get other Uratha to construct them for them, specifically for this act.

ZombieKnowledge:

Does that sound feasible to any of you more experienced players/ST's?  Any insight/information/advice you could share would be appreciated.  Thanks!

Yeah sounds like a damn fun scenario, I had a similar story in mind for an old Apocalypse game, where the pack was going to help in the rite to form a new Caern, while a horde of wyrmspawn came at them.

One idea I had, and this depends on how much time you feel the ritemaster needs inbetween rolls, is to actually play out the time based on turns.   Example:  The extended action is rolled once every minute, so since a round is roughly 3-6 seconds, play out those seconds, keep track of the duration, and assuming the defenders are able to hold the line long enough, the ritemaster gets a roll.    Now of course this idea becomes unwieldy if you are considering a rite where the rolls happen say once very hour.  In cases like that it might be better to work it in small periods of frenetic combat, followed by periods of calm as the attackers regroup. Then you could fast forward the time a bit to allow the roll.  Say maybe 2-4 waves of assault , each happening every 15-20 mins or so, and by the end, viola, an hour has passed and he gets to roll.  However I find it hard to believe the forces trying to stop them would pause for periods of time that lengthy, but you get the gist of what I'm describing, tweak it to best fit your scenario. :)

I would say be sure to describe the build up of the spiritual energy as the rite approaches completion, so they can get a sense of the upcoming climax, should help to heighten tension and result in a more enjoyable fight. :)  good luck and let us know how it turns out.

Considering it isnt the entire territory tainted, but perhaps a building, the ritual you would want the elder ritualist to use is probably The Choosen Ground (lvl 4 rite). The whole pack would need to cull any spirit who would interveine previously to perform it and then participate in the rite with the rite master after that.

Not wanting to hijack the thread or anything, but I feel this a bit more general question fits here quite perfectly: How do you heal a wound in your games in the first place? IS there some official material about it? After reading many of the Werewolf books it feels like the wounds are almost impossible to heal even without the hordes of negative spirit floating about, when it comes impossible.

Thorfred:

After reading many of the Werewolf books it feels like the wounds are almost impossible to heal even without the hordes of negative spirit floating about, when it comes impossible.

Well browsing through Lore of the Forsaken they make mention on several occasions of destroying or healing Wounds, they do not give any hard and fast rules on how to do it.  The closest I found was to remove the source of the tainted Essence in the area, and then purging it in some way.   I think they want to leave it up to the ST to decide exactly what will work and what won't.

My personal opinion would be to flood the area with a resonance of Essence that is the polar opposite of the Wound, probably accompanied by the Spirit Ban (?) rite,  the one that lets you lock down an area and prevent spirits from coming in.  Then the Uratha would have to do a lot of actions to encourage the new type of Essence to start to flow.

Or just come up with a rite of your own making :)

This is an interesting conundrum. I have the same issue in my Werewolf game at the moment - how to rid themselves of a Wound in their territory?

As has been stated already, the books don't offer any solutions. The best I can come up with is a Rite of Chosen Ground, but you need a locus nearby in order to use it. I like the idea of flooding the area with a certain resonance and banishing hostile spirits, but I am not sure how this would work in practice.
 
So I think the better option is to provide the PCs with rumours of an ancient rite that might cleanse the Wound, but is difficult to track down and difficult to use - which is pretty much what you have come up with. I have broken it down into four stages:

1. Require the pack to perform some kind of quest to get access to the rite. Perhaps the elder who is rumoured to know the rite is in another town/city/state or lost in the spirit wilds. Or perhaps no Uratha alive knows the rite - they must track down an ancient but proud "ancestor" spirit. Or an ancient enemy of the People - a vampire - somehow "stole" the rite and is the only one who can "teach" them.

2. Once they acquire the rite, they need to prepare for it. Maybe it requires ritual fasting, preparation of the area to be affected, or something else which is a challenge. The Rite of the Chosen Ground has a few good ideas worth stealing from.

3. Once the preparations are complete, the rite needs to be performed. Obviously, the Maeljin (Lord of the Wound) in question will have a vested interest in seeing that the rite is not successful and that all who learn the rite are eliminated and will throw everything they have at the PCs to stop them. Other Maeljin may assist, but some of them might want the Wound cleansed so that they can diminish the influence of their rival(s). A maeltinet (servant spirit) from a rival Maeljin might appear and offer the PCs its aid - for a price. Do the PCs accept in the face of overwhelming odds? This should be a very dangerous stage for all the pack - some may not survive.

4. If the PCs succeed, the Wound is cleansed and the PCs are heroes. So what now? Many other packs will be interested in learning the rite from the PCs and will travel far and wide to learn it from them. This could cause problems as local territories are invaded by the influx of rite-seeking werewolves - probably including a few Pure. Many Bale Hounds (a pack) would be tasked with destroying the PCs and the knowledge of the rite once and for all. Other supernatural groups might be interested in the PCs - mages for sure. Also, lodges might approach the PCs and offer membership.

So, there are lots of interesting ways it could pan out. I think that if the PCs succeed, it should change the balance of power in their community at the very least and earn them some prestige (and Renown).

Knight of the Wolf:

If the PCs succeed, the Wound is cleansed and the PCs are heroes. So what now? Many other packs will be interested in learning the rite from the PCs and will travel far and wide to learn it from them. This could cause problems as local territories are invaded by the influx of rite-seeking werewolves - probably including a few Pure.

Perhaps the pack could petition the spirit they learned the rite from to become the patron-spirit of  a lodge around the Rite and its purpose?  This could become an entire storyarc in itself, with the pack being at the forefront of a significant power structure in Uratha society.

Knight of the Wolf:

Other supernatural groups might be interested in the PCs - mages for sure.

Eh, I gotta disagree there, the rites that Uratha learn can only be done by them (at least as far as the RAW material I've seen, but hey I could be wrong), so unless the mage is trying to hire the pack to come work the rite for him, I think they wouldn't be too interested in trying to learn it.   It's not Supernal working afterall.    Besides, the likelihood of the mages finding out is uncertain as well.  One of the rules the Uratha live by is to not let the herd know.  So unless the pack is out broadcasting to everyone, or maybe a powerful Spirit mage grabs some spirits and wrings the information out of them, I'm not sure they would even know how they did it.  Not to mention even knowing there was a Wound there in the first place.  Uratha guard their territories quite fanatically, and unless the mage was in the area already(i.e: the mages territory overlapped the Uratha's(, he might not have an easy time figuring out whats going on.

Knight of the Wolf:

Also, lodges might approach the PCs and offer membership.

 

Depends on the purpose of the Lodge, see my first response for how I think this might pan out instead :)

Knight of the Wolf:

I think that if the PCs succeed, it should change the balance of power in their community at the very least and earn them some prestige (and Renown).

Most definately.  It should also earn them some pretty nasty new enemies as well  >:)

Actually the guidelines for resolving a wound can be found on page 39 Territories.

There it describes it as a war, not a battle. The spirits of that place must be captured or driven away and powerful rituals of cleansing enacted on the sight while on the material side efforts are taken to sooth the memory of the event.

As to the above suggestion that other vampires will come to investigate the disappearance, that is definitely on the agenda of the spirits of that place.

What kind of spirits are there, I am guessing, blood spirits, hunger, gluttony, pain and murder??  If any of them have the ability to Urge (Living Fetter Numina) that is the most direct path to getting vampires. Claiming for these spirits will be more difficult as they need human or animal host that fit their needs, and Supernatural beings like vampires are immune to being Ridden. Perhaps a rabid stray dog would be the easiest find, with Animalism vampires would be able to communicate with it. Possibly a starving stray would work for the hunger spirits.

Please note spirits are hard to destroy, especially ones that can Discorperate at will (I suspect Hunger, and Blood spirits may find that ability to fit their idiom). Containment is going to be a big issue for Forsaken, if they just crunch down on that location the spirits might try to recreate it elsewhere, possibly inside their territory or in an adjacent territory. Problems with neighboring packs because the packs problem moved to its back yard is challenging and paints the pack as incompetent jack-asses. Bad rep is a bad thing to have when your neighbors normally deal with problems by beating it down. It is a bad idea to become a problem for your neighbors. First offense, some nasty growls maybe some smack talk if the pack is new. Repeat offenses and the other pack might decide no neighbor is better than an incompetent neighbor. Point of note, make sure it is PC fault, don't make it impossible for there to be a right choice that they have the option of choosing. That only frustrate players and takes enjoyment away from the story.

Containment is not so bad until they start to squeeze down to remove the Wound, they spirits have motivation to stay in a place that suits them, and to maintain that place. The spirits may leave to lure more victims and vampires to the site but they will still be based in the Wound.

There really isn't an easy answer without consequence. Even condemning the apartments, bulldozing and making the land into a parking lot with constant security, leaves a lot of unpleasant spirits with nowhere to feed and a terrible appetite. A change that sudden will just make them recreate the site in the nearest place they can.

The best choice could be to leave the wound but manage it so it doesn't grow. Beat the crap out of the spirits, let them know you could take away their playground, but you'll let them stay if they follow the rules. Monitor it, make sure no spirit steps out of line, no influencing the material side, no possession, no claiming, no urging. They probably want assurances that what they need will take place at the site, which mean blood shed, killing and gluttonous hunger, which may be done without vampires. Most likely it'll be easier to moderate and bring back to balance if you keep vampires away, and look for other ways to fulfill those essences.

Even in the best case some spirits will not accept the sales pitch and will have to be turned into fetishes, or chased away, to cause problems elsewhere, as listed above. Hopefully it'll be a spirit court, and toppling the top rank will make the other spirits willing to negotiate.

Basically.. the Pack has to completely change the Resonance of the Wound. Which is not an easy task as the Wound will continue to draw people and spirits to it that reinforce it.

I do miss the Rite of Cleansing from Apocalypse.. and am thinking of having my Bone Shadow Ithuar create a new version to help with the process. Maybe a Rite that resets an object or persons "resonance" to "neutral"..

Alabaster Xnight:

Actually the guidelines for resolving a wound can be found on page 39 Territories.

There it describes it as a war, not a battle. The spirits of that place must be captured or driven away and powerful rituals of cleansing enacted on the sight while on the material side efforts are taken to sooth the memory of the event.

I completely missed that, thanks! I guess Territories is useful after all :)

I note that the solution appears to be similar to preparations for the Rite of Chosen Ground. Also, it mentions cleansing rituals, so we weren't too far off the mark.

Alabaster Xnight:

The best choice could be to leave the wound but manage it so it doesn't grow. Beat the crap out of the spirits, let them know you could take away their playground, but you'll let them stay if they follow the rules. Monitor it, make sure no spirit steps out of line, no influencing the material side, no possession, no claiming, no urging. They probably want assurances that what they need will take place at the site, which mean blood shed, killing and gluttonous hunger, which may be done without vampires. Most likely it'll be easier to moderate and bring back to balance if you keep vampires away, and look for other ways to fulfill those essences.

I agree that this is the easier option in the short term, although it might not be in the long run, especially if the managing pack is disbanded or destroyed. The more heroic option is to attempt to cleanse the Wound as above, but I think that would be an epic challenge for most packs.

Shaitan40too:

Eh, I gotta disagree there, the rites that Uratha learn can only be done by them (at least as far as the RAW material I've seen, but hey I could be wrong), so unless the mage is trying to hire the pack to come work the rite for him, I think they wouldn't be too interested in trying to learn it.   It's not Supernal working afterall.    Besides, the likelihood of the mages finding out is uncertain as well.  One of the rules the Uratha live by is to not let the herd know.  So unless the pack is out broadcasting to everyone, or maybe a powerful Spirit mage grabs some spirits and wrings the information out of them, I'm not sure they would even know how they did it.  Not to mention even knowing there was a Wound there in the first place.  Uratha guard their territories quite fanatically, and unless the mage was in the area already(i.e: the mages territory overlapped the Uratha's(, he might not have an easy time figuring out whats going on.

Good point. I know very little about mages in the NWoD, but I was thinking that a Spirit mage would be the one most interested in a pack of werewolves cleansing a Wound. Then again, a mage of sufficient power and motivation might be able to cleanse the Wound themselves.

MisterShifter:

I do miss the Rite of Cleansing from Apocalypse.. and am thinking of having my Bone Shadow Ithuar create a new version to help with the process. Maybe a Rite that resets an object or persons "resonance" to "neutral"..

Try this one instead. It's a bit too "Storyteller and player decide" to get into an official book, but assuming you're playing with friends then it shouldn't be too dickish.

The Changing Land (•••)
Many werewolves do the work of Mother Moon as well as Father Wolf, bringing change to the world. This change is rarely good or bad, it just is—for that is the nature of Luna's curse, to change without ever knowing. Some packs affect physical change, either through gross violence and property damage or political action. Others try to change an area's spiritual nature. Again, many use brute force, hunting undesirable spirits and tearing them asunder, threatening terrible retribution were they to return. One of the most effective ways is to target the resonance directly. Some humans claim to be able to perform similar feats^*, but their changes are fleeting. Channelling the merest shard of Luna's nature, the Uratha can do so much more.
This rite shifts an the resonance of an area roughly the size of an apartment or townhouse, changing it from one descriptive term to another, related term. For example, an area with the resonance of "Murder" could change to "Death", but not to "Kittens". This rite can be performed over the same area repeatedly to afford greater shifts in resonance, but only once per lunar month. Each time, it must be performed during a different moon phase to the month before.
Performing the Rite
The ritemaster builds a fire of willow and ash in the area he wishes to affect. Next, he marks the outer edge with ancient symbols that seem to shift in front of the eye. Traditionally, he uses a paste made of chalk dust, rainwater, and one drop of blood from every werewolf involved, though some find that painting the symbols with silver spray-paint works just as well. With the area prepared, the ritemaster lights the fire and sings or drums in tune with the resonance of the area. As he feeds items symbolic of the area's resonance to the fire, he shifts his rhythm to one better suited to the new resonance.
Dice Pool: Harmony
Action: Extended (15 successes required, each roll represents 15 minutes singing/drumming)
Cost: 1 Essence
Roll Results
Dramatic Failure: The Moon's shifting energies are too much for the ritemaster to control. The resonance changes, but to a related term chosen by the Storyteller.
Failure: The resonance proves too strongly entrenched to alter
Success: The Storyteller should inform the ritemaster's player of the area's current resonance. The player then decides on the new resonance, which must be related to the old one but distinct from it: "Murder" to "Death", "Death" to "Rebirth", or "Hatred" to "Vengeance" (which could later change to "Justice"). Use these as examples; if the Storyteller and player can't agree to a satisfactory term then ask the whole troupe for their input as to an acceptable new resonance. On a success the resonance does change to something different but related to the existing resonance; simple synonyms or other attempts to keep things the same do not fly in the face of this rite.
Exceptional Success: The resonance shifts as per a success, but it's easier than the ritemaster first thought. He regains the Essence spent to power this rite.

^*: Referring to the Corruption Tactic in Witch Finders, a supplement for Hunter: The Vigil. That Tactic could be retrofitted into a Pack Tactic for werewolves without too much work.

how big would the area of effect be? I think that rite is far more powerful than a lvl 2 ritual. (Considering that rituals which create verges, barrens, etc even temporally generally are lvl 5 rites.)

DigitalRaven:

For example, an area with the resonance of "Murder" could change to "Death", but not to "Kittens"

But I want an area with the Resonance of Death Kittens  :(

They would look so cute, running around in little hooded cloaks, with scythes in their paws, all yowling out  MEOW!