Random Thought:Angelic Pantheon

I have absolutely no rules for this as of now, but I was watching Dogma at a friend's homestead on friday (by the way, on the off chance that I'm not the last person in the world to see that, it's great inspiration for Scion and a generally hilarious movie) and this idea hit me:A Scion Pantheon based on the Judeo-Christian angels.

People have written at least one.  Search here or check the wiki.  I for one am greatly against it.

Though controversial, there have been a number of attempts to do something like this over the years.  The ScionWiki has two:

I'm of the opinion that a Judeo-Christian pantheon doesn't fit properly in the Scion Universe, but if that is your cup of tea, check out BlainTog's links. They should either provide an existing pantheon for you to use, or give you a good starting point.

vhurka:

This is all I have. Again, these are just random thoughts. So...what do people think?

The Abrahamic religions is a touchy topic for scion, one that's been addressed on multiple occasions. With this in mind, Scion is about ancient pantheons coming back into the world, kicking ass, etc. More importantly, a big theme in Scion is that the players can reach the height of power and unseat their progenitors, whomever they may be.

This means an all-powerful, all-knowing entity does not work in scion because such a being would have to be beyond even the Titans (remember true monotheism implies an omnipotent, transcendental being, something that is far beyond the power of even the Titans, and thus impossible for the Pcs to ever reach). Because of this, the modern understanding of the Abrahamic Faiths is simply not possible in Scion without making a very big change to the themes and implicit truths of the setting...

Now if that works for your games, fine... Go for it and have fun. It will be significantly different from core scion but if you and your players are having fun because of it cool, that's the point.

To remain withing the bounds of core scion. Any use of the abrahamic religions cannot use modern definitions of the Religion but rather the ancient, root origins of the faiths. That is early Judaic, Canaanite, Semitic origins. Back then, they weren't montheistic they were henotheistic or monolatric.

Henotheism: the concept that while other gods may exist, a given group only worships one good for various reasons without denying the possible existence of others or the possible equal validity of other gods.
Monolatry: Where a given group worships and regards one god over others without denying the existence of other gods, period

This would actually fit more in core scion.

BlaineTog:

Though controversial, there have been a number of attempts to do something like this over the years.  The ScionWiki has two:

The Divine Holy Host.

The Elohim.

And The Grigori is also about angels, though it isn't Judeo-Christian.

Of the two Christian ones, I prefer The Elohim, though it needs a new (and complete) PSP.  Were I to include something like this, I'd re-do it, but it'd look an awful like The Elhoim anyway.  I probably wouldn't include it to begin with, though.

I for one like using the Divine Holy Host

Yami Blade:

I for one like using the Divine Holy Host

I think partially I'm repelled by the PSP (which is admittedly a bit irrational given that I'd replace the Elohim's PSP anyway), though that it posits the existence of God Almighty is also a problem, as High Quabalist pointed out.  At the very least I'd want the question of capital-G God's existence to remain existential (since it isn't strictly speaking impossible that He already exists in the canon Scion universe, just more generally thematic if He doesn't).  As for the PSP, my preference would be for it to about Faith rather than Truth.

I did my own version, based on the old Canaanite and semitic roots and worked a history into the how they fit into the scion verse. It turned out to be a lot easier then it looks when I simply understood that the root origins are really the source material you need to make a viable pantheon that could work in the core universe...

High Quabalist:

I did my own version, based on the old Canaanite and semitic roots and worked a history into the how they fit into the scion verse. It turned out to be a lot easier then it looks when I simply understood that the root origins are really the source material you need to make a viable pantheon that could work in the core universe...

Please share some of your work. You never know you may inspire someone else to do the same.

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As for myself, right Now.
I just using ATEN and the Seraph. for the most part.
ATEN is their TITAN (big GOD) they look to. Check.
The Patheon itself is made up of the Angelic Creatures under it. (God level) Seraph, (demigod level) Archangels, Angels, and (Hero level) Nephilim "Scions".
The Pantheon calls "Scions" Nephlim however. The Scions of the Pantheon use the normal rules for Scions to rise in power.
As for the Pantheon Unique Purview, I'm thinking of basing it on the Luminous Template. As I see it the Luminous Template is a simplified Purview for NPC opponets to make the ST's job easier. I just need to expand it out in levels for PCs.
example :
Light Sword = At God level at some some point you can select  an upgrade for it to match the Seraph stats. Same for Light beam. I see it kind built-like the Jotenblunt purview but around the Light Beam, Light Sword, Flight, and Flare powers of the Hands of Aten.
This is just a very very very very ROUGH work up. I may need to remove the Churb level powers altogether.

*Flare (same as Cherub) Actions
** Flight (same as Cherb) 75 mph
*** Light Beam (same as Cherb) One hand only.
--
**** Flare 2 (As Angel) Minutes
**** Flight 2 (same as Angel) 150 mph
***** Lightbeam 2 (Same as Angel) Both Hands can fire beams now.
*****  *  Flare 3 (as Archangel) Hours
*****  *  Flight 3 (Same as Archangel) 300 mph
*****  **  Light Sword (Same as Archangels)
--
*****  *** Flare 4 (as Seraph) Days
*****  ****  Flight 4 (as Seraph) 600 mph
*****  ***** Light Beam 3 ( As Seraph) Aggravated
*****  ***** Light Sword (As Seraph) Aggravated

ABERRANT_SCION:

Please share some of your work. You never know you may inspire someone else to do the same.

Well it's not complete, what with school work and all and last time I tried, some people throat jumped me. So dunno if its worth my time posting what up until now is a document that amounts to 20+ pages of work. That said the work has evolved a lot so anyone interested on hearing more could Pm me for more info or just to discuss the subject and offer their opinions.

But basic idea is this: What modern understanding call archangels is just the modern guises worn by the old Canaanite gods from before actual monotheism took hold along with a few odd balls that joined the pantheon. Acceptance of monotheism amongst mortal worshippers by the pantheon is actually a cunning way (long story, that I'll hapily explain if anyone asks) to neuter the order of the divine glory and turn fatebinding in their favor.

BlaineTog:

Yami Blade:

I for one like using the Divine Holy Host

I think partially I'm repelled by the PSP (which is admittedly a bit irrational given that I'd replace the Elohim's PSP anyway), though that it posits the existence of God Almighty is also a problem, as High Quabalist pointed out.  At the very least I'd want the question of capital-G God's existence to remain existential (since it isn't strictly speaking impossible that He already exists in the canon Scion universe, just more generally thematic if He doesn't).  As for the PSP, my preference would be for it to about Faith rather than Truth.

But, those are just my preferences.

I think  it's because I also play this RPG called In Nomine, which many of the archangels in the DHH are based after.  I basically retconed a few things for my game to make it workable   (the DHH, not the setting itself). 

Yami Blade:

I think  it's because I also play this RPG called In Nomine, which many of the archangels in the DHH are based after.  I basically retconed a few things for my game to make it workable   (the DHH, not the setting itself). 

In Nomine is a good game. I thought about using to base the "angels" on at first, but saw it would be alot of work sliming it down for Scion's purposes. Next I thought about the Seraphim from Armageddon. Again all the special powers need sliming down for Scion. Then I bought Scion God and saw how the Hands of Aten worked already. I saw it much easier to work their special powers as its own purview. Use PCs as normal Scions + special Angel Purview. Done.

ABERRANT_SCION:

In Nomine is a good game.

It's interesting, but I really could not deal with the system. That and it could not decide if it was being funny or not...I don't mind some humor (obviously) but In Nomine was kinda inconsistent with presentation. Still had some good points certainly. I loved Cherubim over there.

Baron Samedi:

It's interesting, but I really could not deal with the system. That and it could not decide if it was being funny or not...I don't mind some humor (obviously) but In Nomine was kinda inconsistent with presentation. Still had some good points certainly.

The original french version was way superior, both in humor and tone...

High Quabalist:

The original french version was way superior, both in humor and tone...

Of that, I am as certain as I can be without having read it. ;)